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Thread: H22 Swap
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Old 01-25-2010, 10:54 PM
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Re: H22 Swap

06-26-2006, 09:54 AM

Originally Posted by Silvaccordex01
So did you get your Intake mani in? Is there as many wiring issues with an obd2 engine as the 1? I wanna do h22 but not if theres all sorts of wiring issues, im not as an awesome mechanic as you!
The manifold is in my garage. I havent installed it yet because Im waiting to do the cams at the same time. I need to borrow a small bracket from one of the techs at work so I can clamp the auto tensioner down as I install the cams. Otherwise its
like doing the T-belt over again. And it was a pain in the *** Out side of the car, Its going to be twice as bad inside the car. And as I had said before, I need to get it re -tuned immediately after the install so as I dont burn a piston or do any major damage to the engine. The way I have it tuned its constantly
in open loop, so the O2 sensor provides no feedback to the ecu.
That being said, the ecu cannot correct for any lean/rich condition that might occur.


Most of the wiring issue that I encountered are outlined in this thread. Just a short list of what had to be done:

1. At first I had wired in a knock sensor for the p13 ecu. The f23a5 doesnt have a knock sensor, and neither does the d16y7 that this p28 ecu came out of. So even though I wired one in, Im currently not using it.
2. I had to re-route the crank position sensor wiring from the crank pulley to the dizzy. Thats shielded wire and and its very important that the shielding is intact.
3. The Temp gauge was a problem. I had to buy a VDO sender and gauge because the factory wiring did not accommodate the sender being directly hooked up to the cluster.
4. The p28 has a different way of controlling the fans when the A/C is on, so I had to wire in a relay that would turn the fans on as the A/C compressor clutch turned on/off.
5. Im using a Sknk2 OBDII-> ODBI conversion harness and havent any problems with it. I can not be scanned using a PGMFI or HDS or any other OBDII scanner now, which also includes getting state inspections. So the car is not exactly legal. Im going to cross that bridge when I get there, I have until september to figure out how to get another inspection sticker.
6. The IACV had to be lengthened and it only used a ground and a 12v reference for OBDI. The 5v reference used for OBDII is no longer necessary.
7. I removed the EGR valve all together, the p28 doesnt even have any accommodations for it anyway.
8. Im not running any EVAP system either, nor a cat. So I basically have no emissions devices whatsoever. That was by choice, except for the EGR.
9. the P/S line had to be changed slightly, I mentioned that somewhere in the thread. As did the driver's side motor mount and the clutch slave cylinder.
10. I got rid of the resistor pack that is normally used on OBDI accords and ludes for the peak-and-hold injectors and bought some OBDII saturated style RC 310 injectors. They are easier to tune with and last longer with higher voltages.

I think thats it for now. The swap isnt exactly for the at home mechanic unless they have a full understanding at to what needs to be done. Also, my car was a standard to begin with, so I didnt have to deal with the auto-->manual swap like a lot of you have mentioned wanting to do.

It definitely helped doing the work at my bro's shop, having 2 professional tig welders at my disposal was invaluable.



EDIT** I forgot I also had to wire in all the VTEC stuff, my stock F23a5 doesnt come with that ****.





06-28-2006, 09:29 AM

Originally Posted by Tampa Railroad Hobo
just out of curiosity in regards from moving the crank position sensor from the crank to the dizzy; would it still work if i left it at the crank or the voltage/readings are totally off?
It wouldnt work a for a few reasons. One, the CKP sensor isnt on the crank pulley, its in the dizzy in the H22. And two, the cams turn twice as fast as the crank, so the signal is twice as fast.



07-12-2006, 11:00 AM

Im not sure how the car would lose power with that manifold, scientifically thats close to impossible. I do dread the install process, Ive been waiting to do it at my bro's shop for a few weeks now, and we cant seem to get all the parties needed together at once. I need to do it there because they
will have to do some more
custom fab-ing to get things to fit properly. And I need to
have my tuner there (AMS Tuning) so he can tune the A/F after the IM and cam install. MY ECU is setup not to go into closed loop, so there is no ECU compensation by the o2 sensor.

As far as my p28, its tuned by AMS tuning (using a custom modified version of Crome). He also setup the launch control and shift light, (although my CEL is behind my oil pressure gauge so I cant really see it anyway).
The VTEC cross over is seamless, there is no huge jump in power like you'd normally see. It
just pulls hard all the way up the gears.

I had no problems walking right by a brand new Civic Si in a straight line at the track the other day, (amongs plenty of other "faster" cars). So Id imagine the power to be somewhere in the upper 160's for wheel hp. Id be satisfied seeing 185-195 whp. I already
spin the wheels, so much more would be less efficient at this time.
I would like to dyno it soon, but $$ has been short, and so has time, so that will have to wait.

As far as that spacer you mentioned, I essentially already have that considering I have no butterflies. All that spacer does is replace the butterfly section of the IM, and I removed those when I did the swap. . . Right now, I want shorter runners.
I would like to see a bit more mid and top end power.
That is exactly what the Skunk2 manifold is for (being modeled after the H22a7 IM with only one set of thicker shorted runners. That with a cams is basically a A type S or ATR configuration.


09-14-2006, 03:48 PM

Originally Posted by MAR387
Drift, if you don't mind me asking how much was the swap and with everything said and done and you being able to hit VTEC ? The more I think about it the more it makes sense to get an h22a4, the
biggest problem will be trying to find an engine with ODBII
Complete swap from Hmotorsonline (engine, LSD tranny, ecu, sensors etc) $2800 (shipped to a business)
Timing belt/water pump etc: about $75 or so (I honestly cant remember)
Lightened flywheel: about $250 or so

If I hadnt done the labor myself and had to pay for all the custom welding: probably close to $1000. (if you go though this thread you'll see everything that had to be changed)

Fluids and misc incidentals: we'll say about $200. (Im part of the broken knock sensor club, thats $130 mistake right there.

I also invested in some parts Im not using. Like I bought a fan relay box thats stock on the lude, but not really needed, and my price through honda about about $110. Its sitting in the bottom drawer of my tool box right now.
And there are a bunch of other things that I had no use for.

Besides the tbelt and water pump, other things that Id recommend replacing would be cap/rotor, wires, and plugs. All the other drive belts. . . and doing an alignment afterward because most of the front end will be apart and when putting things back together usually things are out of adjustment.

Im sure I forgot some things. And I would never say that its an easy "drops-right-in" swap. The wiring alone took me about 3 days, and I didnt even have it 100% (mentioned in this thread also.)

All in all, If one were to approach this project, Id plan on spending at least $5000 total.

I say it all the time, but you want to make sure its done right the first time, even if it takes a little more time and money. Because if you have to go back later to buy other **** or make a repair its going to be twice as expensive and time consuming.




Not to be too long winded here. But OBDII is more expensive over all, (new engine=more money) and there are more wires to go through. You'll have to get a 96 P13 that ODBII because all the years after that have the immobilizer system.
Most everything else to similar and is outlined somewhere in thie thread.
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