Frankensteins Official Thread

Rusty Accord

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Ok guys, damaged is assessed. Looks like a connecting rod failure. Ill try to upload pictures but basically the rod broke, destroyed the girdle, crankshaft and actually broke a piece of the cylinder off. There is no way to rebuild this. So it looks like F23 it is. Im curious as to why this rod broke though. It actually broke in 4 places but that could be because the crank chewed it up.

It's possible that the crank was "chewed" up. It could also have been partly done by the PO of the engine, and you never knew it. It could also have been done by not changing the oil often enough (before you got it), or running in a dusty area. Don't know. Hell, it could even be a combination of all the above too.

I've blown up a few engines before, but not a Honda ...yet (knock on wood). But I've found anything can happen. Was it #4 rod? Just asking as that 1 is the furthest from the oil pump.

It's kind of funny, in that on the Civic forum everyone wants to use the stock Honda rods, as they claim they're the best for those on a budget (not wanting to spend the money for a Crower or a Manly rod). In fact a large percentage of the engine builds (including those on you tube) call out specifically for using the stock rod. And some of these are turbo engines being built.:eek:
Thanks for the update.
 
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capsidx

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Ouch.

Might wanna take your CL ad down :/
Im too lazy to do that lol. I'll be putting in another H23a1 because im an idiot. The motor is the same price on ebay for a "low mileage JDM" motor. They're both 600. If I get the F23 ill need all new mounts and a harness. If I get the H23 again I wont need anything. I think what happened was the oil was too far away from the pickup as I was accelerating hard uphill when the rod went. I think the bearing seized and thats what killed the rod. I cant say this for sure but this is my educated guess. I know its probably not practical but I may just invest in a Moroso oil pan which has baffles and a door to prevent this exact thing from happening.

I know a lot of people say drive the car easy but I cant do that all the time so I guess I should be prepared to deal with these problems if i'm going to beat on the motor. :superhack:

It's possible that the crank was "chewed" up. It could also have been partly done by the PO of the engine, and you never knew it. It could also have been done by not changing the oil often enough (before you got it), or running in a dusty area. Don't know. Hell, it could even be a combination of all the above too.

I've blown up a few engines before, but not a Honda ...yet (knock on wood). But I've found anything can happen. Was it #4 rod? Just asking as that 1 is the furthest from the oil pump.

It's kind of funny, in that on the Civic forum everyone wants to use the stock Honda rods, as they claim they're the best for those on a budget (not wanting to spend the money for a Crower or a Manly rod). In fact a large percentage of the engine builds (including those on you tube) call out specifically for using the stock rod. And some of these are turbo engines being built.:eek:
Thanks for the update.

Honda rods seem pretty stout but upgrading them is usually unnecessary. Honestly if the rods couldnt handle I/H/E then everyones honda would explode like mine did lol. The #2 rod was the one that went. I saw the bearing just chilling on the balance shaft. I'll grab pics this weekend to show you guys how bad it really was. Since this was a junkyard motor I think you might be right about the condition. The car had front end damage but the motor was cosmetically fine. That doesnt mean the rod didnt somehow bend from the impact which is my guess as there are usually no symptoms of a bent rod. I also saw the engine covered in oil so I know it was leaking pretty bad before I got it. My guess is they let it run low or dry a few times because the VC was leaking as were the cam seals, both balance shaft seals and the front main. The oil went from the head to the pan so its a pretty good guess. So do you think i'm crazy for giving this motor another chance? I know the frm sleeves are garbage (apparently) but they seem to be fine until about 150k which takes a long time to rack up.
 
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Rusty Accord

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Im too lazy to do that lol. I'll be putting in another H23a1 because im an idiot. The motor is the same price on ebay for a "low mileage JDM" motor. They're both 600. If I get the F23 ill need all new mounts and a harness. If I get the H23 again I wont need anything. I think what happened was the oil was too far away from the pickup as I was accelerating hard uphill when the rod went. I think they bearing seized and thats what killed the rod. I cant say this for sure but this is my educated guess. I know its probably not practical but I may just invest in a Moroso oil pan which has baffles and a door to prevent this exact thing from happening.

I know a lot of people say drive the car easy but I cant do that all the time so I guess I should be prepared to deal with these problems if i'm going to beat on the motor. :superhack:



Honda rods seem pretty stout but upgrading them is usually unnecessary. Honestly if the rods couldnt handle I/H/E then everyones honda would explode like mine did lol. The #2 rod was the one that went. I saw the bearing just chilling on the balance shaft. I'll grab pics this weekend to show you guys how bad it really was. Since this was a junkyard motor I think you might be right about the condition. The car had front end damage but the motor was cosmetically fine. That doesnt mean the rod didnt somehow bend from the impact which is my guess as there are usually no symptoms of a bent rod. I also saw the engine covered in oil so I know it was leaking pretty bad before I got it. My guess is they let it run low or dry a few times because the VC was leaking as were the cam seals, both balance shaft seals and the front main. The oil went from the head to the pan so its a pretty good guess. So do you think i'm crazy for giving this motor another chance? I know the frm sleeves are garbage (apparently) but they seem to be fine until about 150k which takes a long time to rack up.

At this point, it's really up to you to decide. You might be fine with a JDM unit.
But then if you watch any of those "Bakoosa" videos on you tube, you might re-think it (it's a sub culture there). They're that bunch who do extreme lowering with lots of camber (picture the rear tires almost laying sideways), and funky exhaust systems (like lightening bolt exhaust piping behind the car, or holes cut thru the hood with the piping going over the top of the car). It's a weird sub-culture that has many different things going on at the same time.

But, if the old engine was as oily as you say, then it probably didn't get regular oil changes, but rather regular oil top ups. I too suspect that it probably was run low on oil a few times which started it's downfall.

If there that much re-work to get an F23 back in it, and you have set up for an H23, then you might as well go that route, especially IF both are the same price. Who knows, you might get lucky with this one.:)
 

capsidx

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At this point, it's really up to you to decide. You might be fine with a JDM unit.
But then if you watch any of those "Bakoosa" videos on you tube, you might re-think it (it's a sub culture there). They're that bunch who do extreme lowering with lots of camber (picture the rear tires almost laying sideways), and funky exhaust systems (like lightening bolt exhaust piping behind the car, or holes cut thru the hood with the piping going over the top of the car). It's a weird sub-culture that has many different things going on at the same time.

But, if the old engine was as oily as you say, then it probably didn't get regular oil changes, but rather regular oil top ups. I too suspect that it probably was run low on oil a few times which started it's downfall.

If there that much re-work to get an F23 back in it, and you have set up for an H23, then you might as well go that route, especially IF both are the same price. Who knows, you might get lucky with this one.:)

I was thinking the same thing. Honestly I should just get some better rods and bearings from the start but that could be costly. So looks like h23 it is. I’d need a new harness and mounts for the f23 so I’d rather just drop in a new h and be done. I ordered a factory connecting rod which arrived today. I have to say they’re rather thin. I thought they’d be beefier but I guess not.
 

Enne

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I know the frm sleeves are garbage (apparently) but they seem to be fine until about 150k which takes a long time to rack up.
Isn't that issue due to people babying those engines and not getting it up to 3500/4000 RPMs periodically to properly coat with oil, or something? Might be something totally different, idk. But I thought I read that somewhere.

This explains it better: http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showpost.php?p=3200289&postcount=2

The gripe against FRM cylinders is not a fair one. You hear it the most with H22A guys. They want to turbocharge their engines but the pistons are weak and need to be replaced. This creates a separate issue because any piston that they could buy, with the exception of one still largely unproven option, is not going to be compatible with their FRM sleeves from a metallurgical standpoint.

So, since FRM sleeves are not compatible with trying to get by doing things the cheap way, they take the brunt of the *****ing. Thus the popularity with putting an F22A/B or F23A block underneath an H22A head.

One factory piston that could be an option is the piston from an F22C. The F20C piston would work as well but it has a slightly larger dome to get the same 11.0:1 compression ratio from a much shorter stroke. Anyway, the F22C piston is FRM-compatible, it has a 30mm compression height(1mm shorter than the H22A), it's an 87mm bore and it's factory forged. The downfall to this piston is that it uses a 23mm wrist pin as opposed to a 22mm pin used by all other F/H/K-series pistons.

One downfall that I've come across is that to bore them its a whole completely different process from standard boring which then limits the amount of shops that can actually bore these motors.
 
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capsidx

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Isn't that issue due to people babying those engines and not getting it up to 3500/4000 RPMs periodically to properly coat with oil, or something? Might be something totally different, idk. But I thought I read that somewhere.

I believe the consensus is that they are soft and wear quicker than iron sleeves. This allows too much blow by and loss of compression. The other problem is they're difficult to work with when they need to be honed and bored because of the material making them more costly to repair when loss of compression occurs. Now, I checked golden eagle and they wanted like 1500 to resleeve my block. I didnt check any other engine to see the price difference but those are the things i've learned.
 

capsidx

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Update, new h23a3 is getting picked up this weekend. Let’s hope this motor hasn’t sat too long and is in good working condition. It’s one of those JDM low mileage motors. I was told it’s got anywhere between 35 to 65k. I’m not sure if that’s true but the block stamp tells me it is EUDM or JDM I haven’t checked the code to see what country it’s in but I don’t have anywhere else to buy the motor from so eBay it is lol. Getting it from some place in jersey. I’ll keep any of the interested parties updated.
 

capsidx

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Major Update: F20b is going in rather than h23a3. Cant wait to see how this goes.:Jedi:
 

capsidx

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Ok, old engine is out. F20b had the wiring harness attached to it so I should be able to run the harness in and plug it right in. Just need to grab the pinout and do a little research before I complete the swap this weekend.
 
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