V6 Brakes swap: Caster out of spec. Isolated case?

[cvjoint]

Brought it back from Big O after doing an alignment with two major setbacks:
1. Front Left wheel gets about 1 degree negative camber more (I adjusted them to -1.6 with Ingalls adjustible arms)
2. Caster is way off: Front Left 1 degree positive, Front Right -.5 degree. Specified range for our cars is 1.8 to 3.8 degrees positive

I believe the negative/too low caster is to blame for the wondering under acceleration too.

Work previously done: V6 brake/spindle swap, tie rods inner and outers replaced and changed from one Ingalls adjustable arm up front to another that allows more negative camber.

So my question is, for those of you that got the V6 brake swap done did you get the same low caster numbers? Do I need to swap some radius rods out from the V6 model or what?
*Edit: I just checked Majestic Honda, the radius rods are indeed different from V6 to 4 cyl model. This might be it ceteris paribus of course, I hope no other related parts are different between V6 and 4 cyl.

I've heard we can add shims to the radius rods to add more caster, has anybody done this?

 

[Sketch o5]

putting on v6 brakes shouldnt screw up any part of your alignment.

 

[cvjoint]

Sure, but with the brakes come the V6 spindles too, maybe they are cast differently. If I see some stock speck caster degrees after someone has done the swap and alignment then I'll troubleshoot something else.

 

[simon_y]

A lot of people here have done a 5 lug conversion and never heard of that issue like that. Perhaps your knuckles might have come from a car that was in a front end crash that might have damaged or bent it slightly.

When I did mine, everything just dropped right into place. My alignment now is still fine after about 6 months now.

 

[cvjoint]

did you swap the spindles too? I was talking to Drift today, he only swapped the brakes themselves, I guess that's what most people do. Do you have an alignment sheet? The reason why I ask is that with F23s you probably won't notice it, I notice it a ton but only when Vtec kicks in on the H22.

Well, off to the junkyard to compare radius rods.

 

[simon_y]

I swapped the whole knuckle along with the hub and everything. Except I'm not using V6 brakes, I'm running a Big Brake Kit (I don't see how that would affect your problems so it shouldn't matter what brakes I'm running)

I have H22 also, But nothing out of the ordinary. It tracks straight and everything even on track. It drives and handles just like when I had 4 lugs before.

No, I don't have my alignment sheet right now, It's in the car somewhere, lol. If you want I can copy down the specs my cars at right now.

When I did the swap all I did was remove the upper control arm from the knuckle, then the lower control arm from the knuckle, then the tie rod and removed the axle nut and redid everything when I put on the V6 knuckle.

Actually re-reading your 1st post you said that you put on Ingalls control arm camber kit right? I have that also (but I took it off) and know that when you try to adjust the camber by sliding the ball joint plate front and back to adjust camber, there are also side to side play which can throw your caster off. I don't know how much it can actually throw it off though.

Edit: just read your 1st post, I don't think your radius rods has anything to do with your alignment being off.

 

[cvjoint]

Well, the car wonders during acceleration no more. Something happened a few hours ago and the whole axle came undone under cornering and full throttle. The wheel came loose at nearly 45 miles an hour and jammed itself good in the wheel well. Fender, side skirt and I imagine quite a bit of the driveshaft is totaled. I'm glad to have made it out with no scratch and no damage to property or other drivers. The car managed to screetch to a stop before hitting the sidewalk on the other side of the road. Car just got towed back to the lot.

Seems like the bottom control arm nut is gone, the axle slid out of the transmission hub. Looking back on Majestic's site there were retainer clips that should have been in there that my car never had Either way the bottom bolt either broke or I did a ****ty job with the cotter pin. I'll have somebody else go at it from now on.

Caster wise I bought the radius arms for the V6. They seem to be the same lenght right next to eachother, the bends are different that's all.

I'm sad and confused, bad day for DIY.

Simon do get me that caster readout if you can find it, although all in all it does seem to be install error or something mechanically unsound at least I will know for sure the caster should come out alright.

 

[simon_y]

I don't have a camera or scanner so I'll have to type it out for you, lol.

Front: (L/R)
Camber: -0.45/-0.89
Toe: -0.01/-0.01
Caster: 2.35/2.44

That's what is says on my spec sheet for the front.

 

[cvjoint]

Thanks Simon that looks sexy! Those are some nice caster numbers, I've been looking at my negative one with sadness, nice to see it's possible.

I had my mechanic drop in today, it turns out I ****ed up that whole spindle swap business. The lower control arm screw threads were shaved and the nut went bye bye, lots of explanations here, all probably my fault. A new spindle, driveaxle, nuts and cotter pins later the car runs very stable, albeit with some bent body work still. Hopefully my caster is better now... we'll see next alignment job.

 

[Drift]

Its a good thing the whole setup didnt come apart on you. When you were explaining it to me, I knew something was fishy.