Going for a re-tune.... (Round #2) Updated 10/28/13

[hotaccord243]

Re: Going for a re-tune.... (Round #2) Updated 2/9/13

im still interested in this build. been looking at every update just havent been posting lol u have some bad luck man. damn like everything that could go wrong went wrong lol but keep it up man the progress is nice! cant wait to see some new numbers!

Thanks bud! Yeah, tell me about it. If there is one thing that could go wrong (even the littlest of things) it will for me. Especially when I am soooo close to being done with the one thing I need to do.... But I can't give up, especially how far I am at this point.

I am super close though and appreciate the props. Its this one thing, tires, then tune time! We shall find out more tommorrow though. Hopefully no more problems (crossing fingers)!

I just try to post up everything to try and help others if they have the same issues or questions when their doing the same upgrades. And also for any suggestions/help/input from others to help me out. Glad to know there are some out there reading this LOL!

 

[hotaccord243]

Re: Going for a re-tune.... (Round #2) Updated 2/9/13

If it's not one thing... it's another..... So got the positive battery terminal installed just now. Here are some photos:

Here is a photo of it on the battery power terminal installed (it's on the bottom) and the small red wire is for the fuel pump, large blue wire is for the 4 channel amp, and the large red is main power. At the top is the negative with a large blue wire going to the ground (as you can see a bit on the far left) and goes to a grounding plate that is sheet metal screwed to the floor and was ground down prior to installation for a clean connection ground:

Here is a photo of everything on the starter (don't mind my apparently white a** hand/arm). The thick plastic loom on top (by my pinky) is to the fuse box, the small red wire (also near my pinky) is to the MSD ignition, and the thick red wire under the a/c lines at the bottom is the power wire at the base of the starter:

Here is a video of what happens when I go to crank the car (sorry for the low quality as it's on my phone):



I have a feeling the starter contact was put into the starter incorrectly, not tight enough, or where the contacts/plunger meet were not cleaned well enough and the feed is not reaching the starter all the way and that is why it just clicks when I go to turn it over. Everything else (besides the starter) is getting power at both connections at the battery and the main fuse box and MSD ignition so that would eliminate anything between the battery and the starter completely.

Called Napa and tried to get a replacement (under warranty) and I need a receipt. Since I was working on it at a friends shop, through the shop, they didn't give me a receipt. The only option I have right now is to attempt to take it apart and see what is going on on the inside of the unit.

I'll try taking the starter out tonight, take it apart, (and probably write a DIY on replacing the contacts of the starter at the same time) clean everything up nice and shiny like, put it back together and in the car and see what it does. Hopefully more to come soon!

 

[AFAccord]

Re: Going for a re-tune.... (Round #2) Updated 2/9/13

Take the starter out and have it tested at a parts store to make sure it's good. I went through the same thing with both my starter and alternator after disassembling and reassembling them. I can think of a could things that might cause what you're seeing. Is your fuel pump priming?

 

[hotaccord243]

Re: Going for a re-tune.... (Round #2) Updated 2/9/13

Take the starter out and have it tested at a parts store to make sure it's good. I went through the same thing with both my starter and alternator after disassembling and reassembling them. I can think of a could things that might cause what you're seeing. Is your fuel pump priming?

Thanks AF! The only reason why I took out the starter is the power post snapped. So I bought a new contact kit that had the post in it and put it back together. It worked fine before, probably take it apart tonight, check the contacts (re-install if needed) and clean them, and try again. If it doesn't work after that i'm going to bring it to an auto parts store to test it tomorrow as i'm driving around for work so it will be easier then.

Fuel pump is priming as soon as I turn the key, so I know that is operational, amp is operational, all lights (both interior and exterior) and all accessories are operational. Checked all the fuses just to be sure and all are good.

Only thing left is the starter as the wiring should be fine as everything else gets power until I go to turn it over, it just clicks instead of cranking. It doesn't even crank, solely clicks once. Has to be the problem right? What other things should I look for as you said you could think of a few things that could cause this.

 

[hotaccord243]

Re: Going for a re-tune.... (Round #2) Updated 3/20/13

So took the starter out and apart. I could tell off the bat that the power side contact was bent slightly which I thought was the problem. Here is one straight versus the bent one:

Here's the other contact side that looked a little burnt:

Here's the plunger when I took it out:

Here's after cleaning the plunger:

Here's it all back together, nice and straight contacts, and EVERYTHING all scuffed up for a clean contact on everything:

Put the starter back in, wired it up, went to go start it, and SAME DA** issue. It just clicks....

Took it back out and bringing it in to go get it tested. If it's bad, then I'm going to try to track down the receipt for it and try to get a new one under warranty. That's all for tonight, i'm frustrated and going to bed.... but thought I'd share my findings....

 

[hotaccord243]

Re: Going for a re-tune.... (Round #2) Updated 3/20/13

So update -

Good news! The starter couldn't be tested but they gave me a new one anyway at NAPA. Installed it, and sure enough it started cranking pretty strong. Not as strong as OEM battery location but still quite strong!

I'm guessing it doesn't start cause it's under 30 degrees here in MN and with E85, it get's a little tricky without throwing more fuel at it, but everything is up and running and cranking HUGE STEP FORWARD!!!!

When it gets warmer I will have to try again (hopefully next week)!

One question is for you battery relocation gurus - do I need to re-route the alternator over directly to the starter for better charging?

 

[Russianred]

Re: Going for a re-tune.... (Round #2) Updated 3/21/13

With all the lights going off like that when you give it power, it sounds like it could be a loose contact or intermittent ground, or both? I would triple check every area related to the relocation process along the whole line.

 

[1NonlyAccord]

Re: Going for a re-tune.... (Round #2) Updated 3/21/13

I know its not really a battery question,but how long does it take for your car to start with the AEM EMS?
Mine takes at least 5 attempts and once if finally fires i cannot let off the gas until it warms up or it will die.(keeping it at 1500-3k RPMS for a few mins.)

 

[hotaccord243]

Re: Going for a re-tune.... (Round #2) Updated 3/21/13

I know its not really a battery question,but how long does it take for your car to start with the AEM EMS?
Mine takes at least 5 attempts and once if finally fires i cannot let off the gas until it warms up or it will die.(keeping it at 1500-3k RPMS for a few mins.)

Right now tried about 5 times and almost got it, but no go. Yet. Haven't touched the fuel map or warm up enrichment tables to try to help with cold starts.

One question is are you running E85 or pump gas? That can make a HUGE difference when it's a cold Minnesota winter still though. Fuel needs to be practically doubled if not tripled for a cold start on E85 (especially with the summer mix that is still in the car) The summer mix is closer to 85% ethanol in lieu of the winter mixes which are significantly less ethanol and closer to pump gas to help with cold starts.

With all the lights going off like that when you give it power, it sounds like it could be a loose contact or intermittent ground, or both? I would triple check every area related to the relocation process along the whole line.

Thanks Nikita. I'll definitely go through and double check all of the grounds and power wire connections a second time regardless. I have a feeling a ground isn't done correctly off the head or not a full ground connection in the trunk which is causing the slight decrease in cranking power.

When I went to start it this evening, the lights stayed on this time, and it cranked hard and constant.

I know E85 vehicles have more trouble in the winter starting (cold starting) and especially with the difference between winter and summer mixes (I still have summer mix E85 in my car which is the reason for the hard cold start). It's still very cold here and bet you anything if I were to mess with it, add fuel map or warm up enrichment table on the AEM EMS it will start right away... thoughts?

Although I still have seen some people run the alternator wire directly over to the starter, or the distribution block off the starter for a better charge to the battery... like so:

Except for the fact that maybe run the power wire straight to the starter from the battery, run a wire from the starter to a distribution block that I have currently, and from there connect the fuse box, alternator, and my MSD Ignition?

Question is which wire coming off the alternator?

From the looks of it, looks like it all comes out of the fuse box and onto the battery OEM way, and in my case is now connected to the starter. Does that work? Can't seem to find a definitive answer. There isn't anything stated about this on either of the DIY's here on 6thgen either. It seems like most people are fine doing it different versions of what I did although probably a good idea to upgrade the alternator while i'm at it to the Odyssey one.

 

[1NonlyAccord]

Re: Going for a re-tune.... (Round #2) Updated 3/21/13

I am just running normal pump gas 91octane.Is it a simple fix? I didnt have the issue with version1 EMS. But when I went to get it retuned it was doing this when I picked it up.

-Also does your throttle have a lag when using EMS? Notice it has a hesitation when I press the gas and kinda a stumble. Sorry for putting this in your thread.